Rank system

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Post by DedSoonTM Tue Oct 12, 2021 4:30 pm

I've been a member of this clan for a little under a year, with probably 6ish month of that being away from RS. I decided to come back for GIM and play with 4 other members of the clan and it has been a blast! Decided to rejoin the CC of course because having a community to hang out with makes the game loads more fun.

UNFORTUNATELY, With the way the current rank system is setup with the clan, new or unranked members cannot participate with the chat as much as they should be able to. Why leave members who create an introduction on the forums and join the clan as guests? I really wanted to be a part of this community again as I was prior, especially with my whole GIM group being a part of this clan, but when you see gzzz in the chat by 10 members every 5 mins and have no idea what's going on, it gets old really fast.

I hope you all decide to change around the ranking system in the future, I've never cared about ranks which is why i never pursued getting one in the past, but to withhold part of the community aspect of the clan in the way of drop and level up alerts so you can congratulate fellow members seems very strange.


Thanks,
Schemon
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Post by Mowp Tue Oct 12, 2021 5:10 pm

Hey Schemon, I understand the frustration and I wish everyone could see drop and level up notifications but unfortunately this is a design choice by Jagex and not the clan. I'm sure if Bear and the others had a choice they would allow guests to see these broadcasts.

There are a lot of reasons why clan membership takes a while to obtain and these are good reasons, ranging from capacity management to maininting the integrity of the clan spirit. If you hang around a little while and act friendly towards the other people in chat I'm sure you'll be given a sapphire rank in no time.

In the meantime there are plenty of people in the chat who type out the clan broadcasts so that guests can see them as well.
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Post by DedSoonTM Tue Oct 12, 2021 5:27 pm

What is the reasoning for not making sapphire the default new member rank after they submit an intro on offsite so they can fully participate.
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Post by ellipsism Tue Oct 12, 2021 5:51 pm

heya schemon! to echo mowp's sentiment, i get your frustration with the broadcast system! however, sapphires (aka smiley rank from before) have always been earned and not just given, even before the clan system changed. guests are always welcome to participate in chat and clan events, as well as the offsite and discord, and there is almost always a clan member echoing the broadcasts so that guests can see as well Smile

you've probably already seen these but if you haven't, there's some good info on the ranking system as well as joining the cc in these threads:
joining the clan & chat: https://www.osrsadvice.com/t5380-joining-the-clan-chat
how to best get promoted!: https://www.osrsadvice.com/t5415-how-to-best-get-promoted

welcome back to the game! hope you're enjoying cc and gim Cool
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Post by Syllabic Tue Oct 12, 2021 6:39 pm

Hey @DedSoonTM, happy to help out with the ranking system a bit (though @Mowp is certainly on the right track, and I highly recommend taking a look at the links @Ellipsism posted as well), cuz I fully understand how frustrating it is to be stuck as a Guest, especially when you're missing out on the level and drop broadcasts that everybody perpetually goes nuts over.

I'll start by saying that one of the primary reasons behind the change is a marked lack of space, even prior to the rework. Jagex has given us 500 rank slots to work with, which is a huge improvement over what we used to have, but really not as much as it sounds like when you're dealing with a clan of our size. To put it in perspective, even with the measures we've taken to slow things down, we're nearly 4/5ths of the way full only about five months on. And we've got more trickling in pretty much every day.

We briefly relaxed our requirements during that first week post-update, and that led to a huge number of signups from people wanting to take advantage of what was essentially a free rank. Some of them were already well-known regulars, of course, but we also have a fair number of people coming and going at any given time, taking temporary advantage of the "services" we offer. And wouldn't you know it; plenty of those people now occupy precious rank spots in CC too! Simply put, it's a much safer bet for us to require some amount of proper participation before you're actually allowed in. Yes, due to the aforementioned space limitations, but also because it ensures that our ranks stay meaningful. Mowp worded it very well: "maintaining the integrity of the clan spirit". I think it's fair to say that we expect more from our members than most clans, at least as far as behaviour is concerned. Anyone can create an account and post an introduction in a handful of minutes. Setting the bar that low means coming to terms with the fact that you're no longer able to properly vet anybody that joins, and in my experience, that (unsurprisingly) attracts (or at least does nothing to deter) people that are more trouble than they're worth.

So, we (the mod team), collectively decided that it was much smarter and safer, on both counts, for us to make all ranks earned, despite the extra inconvenience on our end. Now, when you see any rank in the CC, you can be pretty sure that they earned it. And yes, as Elli said, this is far from a new change. It's been in place since early 2020. It's simply more noticeable now with the rework, due to the way Jagex decided to gate off certain features. Trust me, if we could change that, we would.

Anyway, I hope that was at least a little helpful! I have a habit of going off on dumb tangents that don't actually have much meat to them, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if it wasn't Razz For what it's worth, my PMs are always on in-game, on here, and on Discord if you ever have questions. I hope you're enjoying your time back with the clan, despite the extra annoyance. I'm confident you'll be able to earn a rank before too long if you stick around!

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Post by DedSoonTM Thu Oct 14, 2021 8:25 pm

I get it now. Was just a LITTLE salty cause of the gzz stuff but i'm over it. worth it for the cool group of people you guys have here Smile
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Post by Bear Sat Oct 16, 2021 12:04 pm

@DedSoonTM wrote:I get it now. Was just a LITTLE salty cause of the gzz stuff but i'm over it. worth it for the cool group of people you guys have here Smile

Thanks for understanding, Larry.  Smile

I'm gonna be typing a lot here to let everyone in on some of the behind-the-scenes going on, not just directed to you but to anyone else that happens to stumble across this, and this seems to be about as relevant of a chance as I'll get to lay it all out. Laughing Also, I may be repeating some of the other posts here with everything I'm about to say, but in my defense, they're really great points.

So myself and many other leaders are in a Discord with the Jagex moderators in charge of the clan overhaul, and have been pushing very hard for them to roll out notifications to everyone in the cc, not just the ranked members. Sadly, as soon as the overhaul was released, we got one single update to the new clan system and Jagex has gone completely silent on us since, other than specifically saying "no, we're working on more important things right now".

They've specifically said raising the limit above 500 is not going to happen for one reason or another (engine work Rolling Eyes ) but we have gotten them to consider giving us a "Member last seen on <date>" like they currently do for mod ranks (though again, mainly silence since then).


If they do give us that feature to see when someone last logged in, we would likely be able to go back to issuing everyone a rank as it would make removing the most inactive members a matter of seconds rather than hours.
You can see the current cleanup method -> here <- and that's after dozens of hours refining the process for accuracy.

Anything easier/quicker/less accurate results in people being upset that they were removed when they just so happened to be online in the tiny timeframes not captured, which usually ends up being a small handful considering the 400 (now 500) member limit, and towards the end we were getting so many new members that the cleanups needed to be done every 2-3 weeks.

Half of those members wouldn't stick around because they would sign up for a Smiley (now Sapphire) before even getting to know the clan and making sure we were a good fit for them, then left for one reason or another without telling us. Since they just signed up, we have to assume they're active and playing and we just happened to miss seeing them, so they would take up space on the friends list for several cleanups before we could say "yep, definitely not coming back" and clearing them for room. So, all that said, it's unfortunately a lose-lose situation no matter what we do until Jagex throws us a bone. Crying or Very sad


As the others above me have beautifully stated though, getting a Sapphire doesn't take too much effort, and Elli's links are a great starter point. One thing I'll specifically reiterate from those threads is that appearances matter. If our goal is to make sure we're issuing ranks to the active members we see sticking around for the long haul, your best bet is to make sure you're being noticed for your activity.

Contributing to the offsite is a great way, for example. Your posts can be seen at any point rather than a mod that just happens to be looking at the cc in-game when you're chatting. If you go to the homepage here on the forums, you'll see a "Latest Topics" section on the left. I can't speak for other mods but that's the first place I look when I log on every day, so I get a pretty good idea of our more active members. Discord is another, similar option but it does kind of work like the cc, in that your messages might be missed unless someone happens to scroll up in that channel (usually a rare occurrence) and happen to be viewing that channel in the first place. Aside from those, naturally your best bet is to just be SUPER active in the cc as that's our #1 area of concern, followed by forum activity here, followed by (meaningful) Discord activity.


When I first joined the clan back in 2017, I never wanted to pipe up because I felt like I was interrupting someone else's conversation, like I was talking in cc when no one wanted to hear what I said, etc. Once I ignored that and started chiming in anywhere and everywhere I could, I started climbing the ranks really quickly since I meshed so well with the clan, the mods and leadership at the time just had no idea because, well, how could they? I didn't interact enough for them to notice. tongue

Anyways, I hope all of this helps anyone with the time and patience to read any of this, and like the others have said, I hope you continue to stick around and I hope to see your name pop up for recommendation to Sapphire soon.

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